tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post5832404603197665746..comments2024-03-05T05:38:22.024-05:00Comments on Left at the Gate: The Global Pari-Mutuel VillageAlan Mannhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12570505944559196118noreply@blogger.comBlogger22125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-5262509624211545292012-10-11T00:15:30.418-04:002012-10-11T00:15:30.418-04:00This point may have been made above, but for those...This point may have been made above, but for those of us who live in non-racing jurisdictions are trapped under a suffocating umbrella of weird hoops and shady off-shore options.Nicholashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01344585684539908751noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-83143949092750047722012-10-09T09:51:40.116-04:002012-10-09T09:51:40.116-04:00http://www.newsday.com/opinion/editorial-run-the-o...http://www.newsday.com/opinion/editorial-run-the-old-nyra-out-of-town-1.4089202<br /><br />Editorial: Run the old NYRA out of town<br /><br />Originally published: October 8, 2012 5:23 PMjknoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-3837801173826085292012-10-08T15:53:01.970-04:002012-10-08T15:53:01.970-04:00And so goes..."anonymous". Talk about &...And so goes..."anonymous". Talk about "underhanded". Quite hilarious, truly. <br /><br />o_crunkhttp://trunkyard.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-59373578955255174372012-10-08T15:44:30.662-04:002012-10-08T15:44:30.662-04:00O_Crunk,
If you re-read them, and then posted wha...O_Crunk,<br /><br />If you re-read them, and then posted what you did, it's you who is deliberately trolling, as I said handle losses were reversing themselves in many places, I did not claim ( as I don't know ) that they are up or down industry wide, nor did I claim they are up substantially. Once again, my comments speak for themselves, that is when they aren't being twisted.<br /><br />You're not as clever as you think you are. And you aren't fooling others as much as you are fooling yourself. Twisting my words reflects on you, and your arguments, not mine. This has deteriorated far enough for me. I am satisfied with my points.<br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-70277397993702162752012-10-08T15:33:12.203-04:002012-10-08T15:33:12.203-04:00Handle is up, what, 1 or 2% this year over last ye...Handle is up, what, 1 or 2% this year over last year? Where's that compared to a decade ago? I guess that it's off 26.5% from 27% a decade ago. Sure, you gotta start somewhere and maybe it's hit bottom, hard to say really.<br /><br />I re-read what you're saying...there's not much there except that I'm "continually confused" and NYRA's not to blame (but no real explanation for why - just current management hasn't been in place for awhile). <br /><br />I mean, work with me here. I'm listening!<br /><br />o_crunkhttp://trunkyard.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-9038786292244766892012-10-08T15:22:57.108-04:002012-10-08T15:22:57.108-04:00O_Crunk,
I'm sorry, you aren't aware that...O_Crunk,<br /><br />I'm sorry, you aren't aware that handle numbers are up this year? Really? <br /><br />My comments here stand up just fine on their own, and need no explanation. If you feel you actually need one, and aren't just trying to reverse things in order to draw attention away from your previous comments, maybe you just need to think about them some more.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-25168115446609627132012-10-08T15:10:00.615-04:002012-10-08T15:10:00.615-04:00I'm open to being wrong and having my mind ope...I'm open to being wrong and having my mind opened to another's point of view. You make some decent if incomplete points. Still waiting for substance to your points - what's your solutions? How are this year's numbers reversing themselves? How's NYRA not responsible for any of it?o_crunkhttp://trunkyard.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-38076825905429357662012-10-08T14:54:16.083-04:002012-10-08T14:54:16.083-04:00O_Crunk,
I'm not off on a tangent, just as I ...O_Crunk,<br /><br />I'm not off on a tangent, just as I am not a troll, and the inferences I have made make perfect sense in relation to your comments. It seems it is you that needs to reread everything here.<br /><br />Take some responsibility for yourself, man, and stop getting angry.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-81320231722984266362012-10-08T14:40:27.098-04:002012-10-08T14:40:27.098-04:00Please tell, anonymous, what the numbers are and h...Please tell, anonymous, what the numbers are and how I'm blaming NYRA for what happened 40to 50 years ago. Time to back up what your saying with some facts, data and information.<br /><br />You're way off on a tangent from what I'm talking about.o_crunkhttp://trunkyard.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-42736237573318543262012-10-08T14:10:06.820-04:002012-10-08T14:10:06.820-04:00O_Crunk,
Your "troll" comment doesn'...O_Crunk,<br /><br />Your "troll" comment doesn't make you look good, in case you are interested in a little self reflection, as it is clear to anyone actually reading that nothing could be further from the truth.<br /><br />The handle declines over the last decade, which are reversing themselves in many places this year, are surely due to many factors. However, people like O_Crunk that basically offer an "off with their heads" solution, without any real substance, rarely ( if ever )with any actual potential solutions. Suggesting NYRA management is to blame, when current NYRA management has only been in place for a very short time, is particularly curious, especially given the recent positive handle numbers. There seems to be a continuing confusion, among many about NYRA, that any person that works under the NYRA heading is responsible for anything and everything that has taken place over the last 40 to 50 years. How does this make sense?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-89218918743700536652012-10-08T13:57:50.149-04:002012-10-08T13:57:50.149-04:0025% decline could be due to many factors. The econ...25% decline could be due to many factors. The economy is the most obvious. The rise in takeout also results in a corresponding drop in handle. Ed DeRosa showed in his last year TTimes blog. Finally, the effective takeout is also raised with the presence rebate/computer players. The simulcast manager at Oaklawn Park has written about that. Sal Carciahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07558226820328137180noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-55136780601072554942012-10-08T13:54:50.836-04:002012-10-08T13:54:50.836-04:00First of all, and tangentially relating to what I ...First of all, and tangentially relating to what I guess what August Song's seemingly random point was, I wish that Obama had argued his points as vigorously and articulately as o_crunk and anonymous!<br /><br />I do have to side with anonymous here, not surprisingly. Seems obvious that NYRA's handle decline is related to that of the industry as a whole. And I would further argue that any decline that is in fact specific to NYRA is more the fault of the dysfunction in Albany that has resisted any reform to the OTB structure that, unlike in other states, vulturizes NYRA's fair share of its percentage of handle wagered through its outlets.Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11074802013115594148noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-13403306961822563212012-10-08T13:36:47.064-04:002012-10-08T13:36:47.064-04:00Whatever man. You're not addressing much subs...Whatever man. You're not addressing much substance of what I'm saying. Your replies are drifting into troll territory.o_crunkhttp://trunkyard.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-71304447369678743242012-10-08T13:22:46.352-04:002012-10-08T13:22:46.352-04:00O_Crunk,
You are now claiming to have made commen...O_Crunk,<br /><br />You are now claiming to have made comments that were, at best, tangentally related to NYRA. However, your first post does not appear to reflect that sentiment. Claiming now that through smoke and mirrors you weren't addressing NYRA, but actually the industry, only makes you seem underhanded.<br /><br />Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-81320683569512118082012-10-08T13:11:29.762-04:002012-10-08T13:11:29.762-04:00Read it again:
The decline of handle *long* prece...Read it again:<br /><br /><b><i>The decline of handle *long* precedes any of the "NYRA sucks" or "NYRA robbed horseplayers".</i></b><br /><br />I don't think that's deceptive at all. It's true. As is NYRA's 25% handle decline in the last decade. If "the proof is in the handle figures", then I fail to see any victories here from NYRA or anyone else in the industry. Even in light of the "way in which horse racing has been out on the lead....at least technologically." You'd think that would lead to some handle *increases*.o_crunkhttp://trunkyard.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-61398448973950476242012-10-08T13:02:42.620-04:002012-10-08T13:02:42.620-04:00O_Crunk,
Your post was, at best, then deliberatel...O_Crunk,<br /><br />Your post was, at best, then deliberately deceptive, as you singled out NYRA and clearly suggested players had abandoned them, when in fact it is the industry that has lost handle, even moreso overall than NYRA. <br />Your final paragraph said players figured out " NYRA sucks " before the media, thus making it clear you were targeting NYRA.<br /><br />If what you are saying now is true, your assertions should never have included NYRA, as they were ( apparently ) about the industry, though for whatever reason you decided to make them about NYRA, and it was only when called out that you claimed they weren't specific.<br /><br />However, thanks for responding and clearing things up. In the future, so as to not create confusion, please try not to cloud the picture.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-38677992727542055602012-10-08T12:47:18.088-04:002012-10-08T12:47:18.088-04:00Handle is down overall, industry-wide, in the US 2...Handle is down overall, industry-wide, in the US 27% in the last decade.<br /><br />I fail to see where I said horseplayer's singled out NYRA specifically. The same problems NYRA has are pretty much the same everywhere else from a horseplaying perspective. Read it again, carefully.<br /><br />I don't think the assertion is reckless. Handle is down and if "the proof is in the handle figures" then in any industry where revenue takes a 25% hit, then it's time for a change. Usually one starts with the management in most cases.o_crunkhttp://trunkyard.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-51024628737202300452012-10-08T11:24:16.872-04:002012-10-08T11:24:16.872-04:00O-Crunk,
You make your assertions about the handl...O-Crunk,<br /><br />You make your assertions about the handle numbers at NYRA without discussing the handle numbers for the entire industry. You clearly suggest that horseplayers have somehow abandoned NYRA specifically. If this is the case, the overall industry numbers must be the same in 2011 as they were in 2002 ( surely you can find sources other than the NYRA media guide ). Let's see those numbers so that you can put some teeth behind your reckless assertions that it is NYRA that is being targeted by horseplayers and not the entire industry that has seen a downturn in handle.<br /><br />Give us the comparisons between the NYRA tracks, Gulfstream, California tracks, as well as other major jurisdictions, and back up what you said. Surely you don't want to be yet another with internet bravado that can't back up what they say with actual facts.<br /><br />Or do you?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-20372810489483163822012-10-08T09:06:31.060-04:002012-10-08T09:06:31.060-04:00Here's the thing though, Alan - if "the p...Here's the thing though, Alan - if "the proof is in the handle figures" as you say, then Fountaine's point is actually *stronger* than just citing attendance.<br /><br />It would be nice to stop talking about attendance like it means anything ("Oh look, 40k people at SAR that means the game ain't dead") and start having a real conversation about where handle has gone. By my quick estimate, NYRA has seen their all sources handle erode by 25% over the past decade.<br /><br />The decline of handle *long* precedes any of the "NYRA sucks" or "NYRA robbed horseplayers". This isn't a chicken or the egg deal either. People stopped playing and that was reflected in *the bottom line*. <br /><br />Now here's the lag of "NYRA sucks" and "NYRA robbed horseplayers". The players figured it out before the media did. The same media your quick to blame here.<br />o_crunkhttp://trunkyard.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-61205885883868943032012-10-07T20:31:33.923-04:002012-10-07T20:31:33.923-04:00He can kiss his hope of landing in the White House...He can kiss his hope of landing in the White House, other than to visit or to congratulate someone else, good-bye.August Songnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-59935765014261198832012-10-07T20:24:30.238-04:002012-10-07T20:24:30.238-04:00Perhaps there is more NYRA "stuff" to co...Perhaps there is more NYRA "stuff" to come, more than just bad takeout math? It does seem odd that Governor Cuomo is dragging the New-New NYRA formation for weeks on end. I just hope it will be worth the wait.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-39448579749908733852012-10-07T15:44:10.815-04:002012-10-07T15:44:10.815-04:00When does the negative drum beat against the NYRA ...When does the negative drum beat against the NYRA end? Cuomo has been in charge for a few months and all this drug stuff has been going on. And he knew about it as he sat on the report. I guess we can now blame him for a these months. Does this make him corrupt (I am only talking about horseracing)?Sal Carciahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07558226820328137180noreply@blogger.com