tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post5781869390889433704..comments2024-03-05T05:38:22.024-05:00Comments on Left at the Gate: Bedbugs and Ballyhoo, Big Brown and BellyachingAlan Mannhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/12570505944559196118noreply@blogger.comBlogger47125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-57576782782116738742008-05-20T15:59:00.000-04:002008-05-20T15:59:00.000-04:00My two cents on the original top of the page comme...My two cents on the original top of the page comment....yes, Secretariat stayed competitive through his 3 year old year. But his record-for-the-time syndication deal kept us from seeing him race at 4. In my mind, nothing's changed in 35 years. It's all about the breeding $$.<BR/><BR/>I leave you with these great articles from the Sports Illustrated Vault. The 2008 racing season is deja vu all over again...;)<BR/><BR/>http://tinyurl.com/4pjoks<BR/><BR/>http://tinyurl.com/4eanu7<BR/><BR/>http://tinyurl.com/3uzxpc<BR/>(great tidbit about why Secretariat's syndication deal was announced so early....)Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-42757776455300619502008-05-20T15:34:00.000-04:002008-05-20T15:34:00.000-04:00Other runners from this decade that would merit co...Other runners from this decade that would merit consideration on the top 100 list (though not necessarily make it):<BR/><BR/>Tiznow<BR/>Point Given<BR/>Azeri<BR/>Ghostzapper<BR/>Curlin<BR/><BR/>Then you have the Euros like Ouija Board and High Chapparal that did plenty in the States to consider as well.El Angelohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14145024095815950963noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-58324056562222877612008-05-20T15:10:00.000-04:002008-05-20T15:10:00.000-04:00Thanks to El Angelo for posting the Triple Crown w...Thanks to El Angelo for posting the Triple Crown winners on the Blood Horse top 100 of the 20th Century. I agree if we updated the list to include those runners in the first 8 years of the 21st C., Big Brown, if a Triple Crown winner, might break the top 50. Are there any other 21st C runners who would make the list? Interesting to note that Dr. Fager, my all-time fave, and incidentally he did not race in any of the TC races, was ranked # 6 on the Blood Horse 20th C list. A number of reasons: Best 4 YO campaign ever (1968), only horse to ever win 4 Eclipse(sprint, turf, handicap, HOY)Awards in one year (1968), set track records at more than one distance,won under 132 + lbs more than once, set track/world record for mile under 134 lbs., won under 139 lbs, never headed in any race straight up, won 18 of 22 lifetime starts with 1 DQ from first. There may be others. That's what Big Brown and others have to shoot for, at least with many of us who remember great race horses like "The Dr". /S/Green Mtn PunterAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-50778944602550759322008-05-20T14:20:00.000-04:002008-05-20T14:20:00.000-04:00If the NY State Racing & Wagering Board ever did a...If the NY State Racing & Wagering Board ever did a thorough investigation into the real ownership of IEAH, instead of wasting time and tax payer money drug testing the back stretch workers and making sure trainers have their workers comp in place, the game would suffer another black eye when it was uncovered whose money was being put to use.<BR/>So instead, the party line will be that it is wall street investors who are funding the operation. <BR/>Sure. Have yet to see the gang in the winners circle.<BR/>And this nonsense about other thoroughbred ventures like a veterinary clinic across from the Belmont for 17 mill. How and when is that investment ever going to pay off.<BR/>This whole operation with its front men is a comedy.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-18187767017331491932008-05-20T12:29:00.000-04:002008-05-20T12:29:00.000-04:00FYI, I've seen two articles dated today that sugge...FYI, I've seen <A HREF="http://superfectablog.blogspot.com/2008/05/speaking-of-big-brown.html" REL="nofollow">two articles</A> dated today that suggest the Belmont is Big Brown's last race, win or lose.<BR/><BR/>I did find one contrasting article, but it does seem to be in the minority.<BR/><BR/>I also posted a bit about <A HREF="http://superfectablog.blogspot.com/2008/05/horses-americans-should-know-ii-soviet.html" REL="nofollow">Elite Racing Club</A> today - I wish we had a group like that, rather than the IEAH setup.Superfectahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13160193760814449962noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-41019226272381367852008-05-20T11:55:00.000-04:002008-05-20T11:55:00.000-04:00I'm a licensed owner via Castle Village. As El ...I'm a licensed owner via Castle Village. As El Angelo said, it's not a big deal. Iavaroni walks his investor into the NYSRWB office at a NYRA track, tells them he's a partner, he gets fingerprinted, pays $100 and he's licensed. Not a matter of public record as far as I know either.Alan Mannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12570505944559196118noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-1053123248842002152008-05-20T11:35:00.000-04:002008-05-20T11:35:00.000-04:00Anonymous (right above my last post):Getting licen...Anonymous (right above my last post):<BR/><BR/>Getting licensed isn't a big deal. Neither is finding 20 guys from Wall Street to come up with $500k each--the bonuses alone have been insane the last few years have bankrolled many dumber and more expensive ventures than these.El Angelohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14145024095815950963noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-63889373362584581672008-05-20T11:31:00.001-04:002008-05-20T11:31:00.001-04:00It's worth stating that winning the Triple Crown d...It's worth stating that winning the Triple Crown does NOT automatically make you a top-of-the pile great. I have some issues with this list, but let's look at where the other 11 winners stack up on the Bloodhorse's list of the 100 best horses of the 20th century:<BR/><BR/>2. Secretariat<BR/>3. Citation<BR/>5. Count Fleet<BR/>9. Seattle Slew<BR/>12. Affirmed<BR/>13. War Admiral<BR/>26. Whirlaway<BR/>28. Gallant Fox<BR/>33. Assault<BR/>49. Sir Barton<BR/>61. Omaha<BR/><BR/>If Big Brown sweeps it, I have no problem putting him on the top-100 list, and if you want to argue he's in the class of Sir Barton and Omaha, fine. And that's nothing to be ashamed of.El Angelohttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14145024095815950963noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-92157204493184907342008-05-20T11:31:00.000-04:002008-05-20T11:31:00.000-04:00Back to IEAH, NYSRWB rules demand that all owners ...Back to IEAH, NYSRWB rules demand that all owners of greater than 5% of a horse be licensed.<BR/><BR/>Are these investors licensed, and if so who are they?<BR/><BR/>Just a bit skeptical that anyone, no matter their WAll Street connections, could raise this kind of capital to invest in racing.<BR/><BR/>Not like these guys were Warren Buffet.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-25072191781299052442008-05-20T11:27:00.000-04:002008-05-20T11:27:00.000-04:00Meant Smary Jones, not Alex.Meant Smary Jones, not Alex.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-55572277126630505212008-05-20T10:50:00.000-04:002008-05-20T10:50:00.000-04:00I agree 100%. Yes Dutrow is scum. Yes, his use o...I agree 100%. Yes Dutrow is scum. Yes, his use of steroids is suspect. But there's no evidence that his cheating past is being recreated with Big Brown in the present. BB deserves all the attention he gets for the next two weeks. One can hate the trainer, owner and jock, and still love the horse. <BR/><BR/>That being said, I don't think anyone would consider Big Brown, even if he does win the Triple Crown, one of racing's 'greats'. He's certainly a very good horse, but he's definitely aided by the medicrity of his competition this year. Maybe if he keeps running full speed for the rest of the year, meets a few older horses and continues to decimate his competition, but he certainly doesn't deserve hero status based on his performances to date.Beckyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17749748635924699861noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-58196494500800646952008-05-20T10:39:00.000-04:002008-05-20T10:39:00.000-04:00>>The governor’s office confirms that Gov. David P...>>The governor’s office confirms that Gov. David Paterson has been hospitalized in New York City.<BR/><BR/>According to the press statement released by the Paterson’s office:<BR/><BR/>“Earlier this morning Governor Paterson experienced migraine like symptoms. He asked to be brought to The Mount Sinai Medical Center for an evaluation. He was evaluated and all preliminary tests were normal. He is now resting comfortably and will undergo further tests during the course of the day.”<BR/><BR/>Paterson was hospitalized last summer when he fainted on a campaign plane and has said he has a condition that is easily remedied by not sleeping with his shirt collar buttoned.>><BR/><BR/><BR/>He sounds a bit sickly to me. Governor Bruno, anyone?Alan Mannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12570505944559196118noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-52800452913789559382008-05-20T10:38:00.000-04:002008-05-20T10:38:00.000-04:00Agreed that the IEAH model only goes to reinforce ...Agreed that the IEAH model only goes to reinforce the present industry business model. But in time, shouldn't the laws of probability shake these players out? I mean, how many times are they going to get lucky like this? (Of course, having all that money to throw at the Paul Pompas of the world helps one make his own luck.)Alan Mannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12570505944559196118noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-54830650123340048082008-05-20T08:36:00.000-04:002008-05-20T08:36:00.000-04:00What will be fascinating is to see the impact of t...What will be fascinating is to see the impact of that purported $100M hedge fund from IEAH on the state of US racing. <BR/><BR/>While it will be a staggered investment, it is still a huge injection of would-be money on runners (vs. buying up broodmares) sent into racing with the expectation of high returns on the track and shed.<BR/><BR/>I think it will be ultimately negative for all but what can you do? Racing shouldn't be a private club where we keep people out "just because".<BR/><BR/>The only way mega returns will be had is if they follow the same 2yr - 3yr formula with colts. We all know of massive fortunes plowed into that chase only to end up with nothing to show.<BR/><BR/>IEAH does own the very honest and solid Kip Deville who does bring in G1-glory at the juicy big day racing events (Keeneland, Breeders' Cup, etc) that are on TV and investors can feel like they are kings. But he's "only" banked $186k this year which could be considered almost a rounding error on a $100M fund.<BR/><BR/>How are big returns going to be had when old pros at Dogwood and West Point, both multi-partnership groups too, are doing the same buying and racing - yet not with mega returns?<BR/><BR/>It begs the question: with all the talent for picking horses, training and racing them, why didn't D. Wayne Lukas go to Wall Street and raise a massive fund for the same purpose in the 1990's vs. working with wealthy owners? I'm sure back in the day he turned down would-be owners who just didn't click with him or the sport. <BR/><BR/>In his interview with Simon Bray, Lukas said that he liked owners who owned professional sports teams. Why? Because they were prepared for losses during the year but looked at ownership long term. Will IEAH have that same perspective when 100 millionaires are ticked that a loosing streak has hit town?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-76989668342950059752008-05-20T07:37:00.000-04:002008-05-20T07:37:00.000-04:00This is as many responses to any LATG post that I ...This is as many responses to any LATG post that I can recall. I believe that it says a lot about the deep seated fan dissatisfaction prevelant in racing today. Dedicated fans want to see honest racehorses, i.e., horses whose connections are ready to risk racing them in open company over time as opposed to some brief, micro-managed, 6 or 8 race campaign designed to win a Triple Crown and/or an Eclipse or 2. Racing fans are always searching between the lines of past performances to see if they are being fooled by the entries in a race. The modern day, micro managed campaigns on the cheap, i.e., a few key races, of Big Brown and others before him is just so blatant that it has many fans up in arms. Their message could be summed up: "Don't claim greatness for your horse unless you are ready to run him against all comers, my track or yours, fast or wet, over more than one season." Jess Jackson seems to be the kind of owner many of us would like to see a lot more of. /S/Green Mtn PunterAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-25794646563142907862008-05-20T05:23:00.000-04:002008-05-20T05:23:00.000-04:00Afleet Alex didn't lose the Belmont.Afleet Alex didn't lose the Belmont.Brooklyn Backstretchhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16741026096444812845noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-54746175612770947002008-05-19T22:51:00.000-04:002008-05-19T22:51:00.000-04:00>>Good question about IEAH, who is the majority ow...>>Good question about IEAH, who is the majority owner from a dollar perspective?<BR/><BR/>It was started by a couple of guys who made a lot of money on Wall Street, and they raised $40 million from investors - and only from like 80 of them.<BR/><BR/>Check out <A HREF="http://www.cnbc.com/id/24638647/for/cnbc" REL="nofollow">this story</A> for more info.Alan Mannhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/12570505944559196118noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-33594095498367093312008-05-19T22:28:00.000-04:002008-05-19T22:28:00.000-04:00Remember, Afleet Alex, Charismatic, Real Quiet, Si...Remember, Afleet Alex, Charismatic, Real Quiet, Silver Charm and Funny Cide?<BR/><BR/>None were supposed to lose the Belmont either.<BR/><BR/>And some of them were beaten by horses no more highly considered than Tale Of Ekati and Dennis of Cork, much less Casino Drive.<BR/><BR/>I will be there rooting for BB, as Alan says for the horse, the sport and the history, but not one part of me will shed a tear for the connections if he loses as I think he will.<BR/><BR/>Every triple crown candidate has three things to overcome, as all of us know. <BR/><BR/>Must make it to the gate in top shape, his jock must not make any mistakes, and must get the distance.<BR/><BR/>Even if he does all that he still may lose if Casino Drive ends up being better than him.<BR/><BR/>I remain skeptical and a contrarian as always.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-36642108188013188602008-05-19T22:20:00.000-04:002008-05-19T22:20:00.000-04:00Good question about IEAH, who is the majority owne...Good question about IEAH, who is the majority owner from a dollar perspective?<BR/><BR/>Are they licensed, if it is an individual?<BR/><BR/>Pension plans?<BR/><BR/>Investors in hedge funds generally are institutional, is this legal in racing?<BR/><BR/>They have come a long way in a short time. All the way from A One Rocket to Big Brown.<BR/><BR/>As for 3 Chimneys assertion of "value", probably true, there is only downside.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-41809199355309154652008-05-19T20:48:00.000-04:002008-05-19T20:48:00.000-04:00Who is the real money behind this IEAH - $2.25 for...Who is the real money behind this IEAH - <BR/>$2.25 for a maiden winner like BB;<BR/>3-5 million for Court Vision;<BR/><BR/>A character who drives into NYC to Wall Street and his partner suddenly have as much money as they want to buy whatever they want?<BR/><BR/>????Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-38885034011348365292008-05-19T19:44:00.000-04:002008-05-19T19:44:00.000-04:00On the HOTY question, in any close competition, it...On the HOTY question, in any close competition, it's gotta go to the TC winner, as winning those 3 races, in five weeks at three, is the toughest test this sport has to offer.<BR/><BR/>Look what it did to Curlin (1/3)!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-77061550232096540642008-05-19T19:01:00.000-04:002008-05-19T19:01:00.000-04:00I was there when Silver Charm & Real Quiet got bea...I was there when Silver Charm & Real Quiet got beat, and was rooting against them (not just because I bet against them). I didn't think they were worthy of the crown, and in retrospect, that opinion still stands.<BR/><BR/>I will be rooting for BB (and passing the race) and I think he can pull it off. But I think he will be tested this time by Casino Drive. Damn I wish I could be Steve in NY next month.<BR/><BR/>I wouldn't want him to race at Saratoga -- I think he'll do better with more time off. My fantasy would be one prep then the BC.<BR/><BR/>I don't think racing ever will be a big sport again. I want them to have to race as full grown ups for the good of the breed and for strictly selfish reasons -- to enjoy the dramatic match-ups myself. I accept the pitfalls in my plan. But there have got to be some ways to change the overriding incentive to retire them so soon.steve in nchttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04061356872686618093noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-36765292712713682532008-05-19T16:35:00.000-04:002008-05-19T16:35:00.000-04:00The only bellyachin' I'm gonna do is if they only ...The only bellyachin' I'm gonna do is if they only race him two more times. Eight races total, all at 3 years old? How amazing would it be see him fill out a little more and race at 4? But overall, it doesn't take away from the excitement he's bringing to the sport. Were there 38,000 foals in BB's year of birth? I'd say he's proving already how special he is. I imagine June 7 is going to be a blockbuster day for more than just us fans of the sport....forego is my witnesshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04785998054727075723noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-91772901643973530422008-05-19T16:33:00.000-04:002008-05-19T16:33:00.000-04:00This comment has been removed by the author.forego is my witnesshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04785998054727075723noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-8711985.post-1296718446409704482008-05-19T16:27:00.000-04:002008-05-19T16:27:00.000-04:00re: if he wins the TC, why not run past the Belmon...re: if he wins the TC, why not run past the Belmont?<BR/><BR/>equdaily.com dug out of the archives an article [link below] where Pletcher said the next TC winner would be retired the next day. <BR/><BR/>Further it cited Three Chimneys telling another owner that continuing to run [another horse sent to stud there] - even with success wouldn't add to the value.<BR/><BR/><A HREF="http://www.thoroughbredtimes.com/national-news/2006/December/05/Breeding-industry-affects-top-level-of-racing.aspx" REL="nofollow">TB Times Dec 5, 2006 "Breeding industry affects top level of racing"</A><BR/><BR/>IEAH, as Andy Beyer reminded us all, was tied in with that "A One Rocket" milkshake mess and has bombed (so far) with their $5M 50% stake in Court Vision. They just tend to bring a certain less then clean feeling to the sport.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com